Chapter 20 The costs and benefits of lying

Interviewer: Hu Jiujiu, New Weekly Time: April 26, 2010 The topic we are talking about this time is the relationship between history and lies.This reminds me of Lao Tzu's saying "Wisdom comes out, but there is great hypocrisy".I don't know if "pseudo" can be understood as "lie"? Can.Or a hypocrite, or a lie, it doesn't matter. This raises the question of the view of history, what kind of history is real? The fact is that there is a system that is particularly prone to producing lies and producing lies.And it is reasonable and cost-effective to create lies.Look at this system in our history: one emperor, a bunch of bureaucrats under him, facing all farmers, farmers have poor information channels.Whether it is Qin Shihuang, Zhu Yuanzhang, or Liu Bang, the person who conquers the world and dominates the country, the problem they must solve is how to dominate the country?The ruler at the highest level has two options: one is to use naked violence, coercion; the other is to use persuasion, to govern by virtue.The two also have different proportions.If we rely on violence alone, the country is very fragile, and it is not easy to last for a long time, or the long-term benefits are not promising.So I partially adopted the method of Confucianism, persuading, persuading, and getting your inner approval.

Then it turns into a set of lies by the rulers. This is a theory.If the rulers really followed this theory, it would not be a lie, at least not much of it.If he doesn't follow the theory, we can say it's a lie. This analysis is too correct. So does he follow it or not?He must not follow. ——It doesn’t mean that you don’t follow it at all. On the one hand, you are required to follow it completely, and on the other hand, you don’t follow it completely.For example, the monarch is benevolent and the minister is loyal, the father is kind and the son is filial, and the husband is righteous and the wife is obedient.My obligation is your right to enjoy, and your obligation is also my right to enjoy, the two of us correspond.Although your rights are too great and my responsibilities are more, but you are a king and I am a minister, and your responsibilities are also great.I accept this account.This is the three cardinal principles and five constant principles of Confucianism, which sounds reasonable.But in reality, the strong side is unwilling to be restrained, it is difficult to submit willingly, and it is easy to degenerate.Often unkind.There are very few benevolent monarchs, and the proportion of wise monarchs in history is very low.However, I am not benevolent, I will not allow you to be unrighteous, and I will not allow you to be unfaithful.This cannot be too unreasonable.It needs to be overbearing and mixed. Confucianism is Confucianism on the surface. It is Confucianism on the surface.In fact, let you submit, I will not submit.I can't let you know that I am not merciful, but I still want to proclaim how merciful I am.If someone challenges me, I will kill him without saying a word.What is actually done is domineering.

If you look at this system, persuasion is very important, it can reduce the cost of governance and increase the benefits of governance.It can form a constraint on people's hearts, and a comprehensive constraint on the hearts of the ruled.Not only has the cost been reduced, the profit has been increased, and the long-term stability has been improved, but the whole system can also give birth to a sense of sacredness and brilliance.This persuasive power is so important that it cannot be given up naturally. Specifically, how to calculate the cost-benefit?The benefit is that the subjects consciously abide by the norms, and the cost is that they themselves abide by the norms and lead by example.The benefits of governing the country by virtue are very large. If you govern the country by persuasion, half of the world will be peaceful if you talk about it.As for the cost, the cost of leading by example is very high. You can’t pay in full, but you have to pay in full, or even overpay, and you are not allowed to expose your old background, so the cost of leading by example is transformed into secretly punishing a few people. The old man blocked his throat.As for bragging and flattering, don't worry about it.In such a system where the benefits of lying are high and the costs are low, large-scale lying is doomed from the very top.

The first and biggest lie is the divine right of kings, and all the lies that follow come from this root.Because it immediately established the legal status of the ruler.You were born the Son of Heaven, you are God's agent.The following civil servants and bureaucratic groups are also the spokespersons of the emperor. You are right.The statement that the monarchy is granted by God itself contains a lie, but this lie is also conditional.It doesn’t mean that God empowers you once and for all. The authentic expression belongs to the destiny, and it belongs to virtuous people. Not everyone can be the emperor.If you have this virtue, the destiny belongs to you.If you don't have this virtue, the destiny of that day can still be reversed, and you can still revolutionize.Then you have to pretend to be virtuous.However, it is not enough to respectfully offer sacrifices to the heavens. The sky sees itself and the people see it, and the sky listens to the people.Then the fate will be yours, and those who covet power will give up.Where the interests lie and the trend of the times, this fundamentally determines that this is a system where lies are bound to appear.

In the end, lies have formed a community of lies in China. This community of lies means that basically everyone from top to bottom has secrets that cannot be told. Sometimes lying is not to harm others, but to protect oneself, to preserve My own life, I must lie. Don't talk nonsense, and don't let people take advantage of you to attack you. We published an article written by Wu Xiaobo.The name is "Qian Xuesen, you still owe a great apology!" ", this article has a great response.The article said that the father of the atomic bomb had written a scientific article about releasing satellites per mu—now, is this a lie?

He also had more specific conversations with Mao Zedong.Mao Zedong said that I read your article.Qian Xuesen said, I also wrote it casually, and there is a data that is not yet accurate.Mao Zedong immediately said, ah, you also screamed.When Mao Zedong discussed this with him, he was a little confused and retreated.Even if his calculation is accurate, it is not a lie in theory, but it still contains room for lies: the theoretical possibility is not equal to the possibility that technology can achieve.In any case, his calculation, according to the percentage conversion rate of solar energy, can yield tens of thousands of catties per mu, which indeed had a very real impact on Mao Zedong.

Later, someone asked Mao, saying that you were born in a farming family, but don’t you know how much you can produce per mu?Mao said, I read Qian Xuesen's article, and all scientists said that. ——At least Qian Xuesen played a role in fueling the flames.So he does owe a great apology.Not great, owes a due modest apology. In the system of intellectuals, if we can divide them into several categories, for example, one category is relatively humanistic and social science intellectuals, the other category is natural science and technology intellectuals, and the third category is bureaucratic intellectuals.Which of these three types of intellectuals do you think is more likely to produce lies?

Official intellectuals certainly are. his daily needs. Yes, this is necessary for governance, but it also depends on the specific era.For example, during the Mao Zedong era, especially 53 years ago, the subjective feeling of official intellectuals was that they had grasped the truth, not lies.They are full of confidence to transform others.At that time, free intellectuals were the targets of reform, and many of them hid their true thoughts and said things against their will.What is the truth and what is a lie seems to be very favorable to the official in terms of subjective standards.After the "Great Leap Forward", the lies were shattered, resulting in extremely disastrous consequences.At that time, even by subjective standards, official intellectuals were the main producers of lies.But at that time, the free intellectuals who knew in their hearts still didn't dare to make irresponsible remarks, and there was too much pressure after the anti-"rightist" movement.So they produce lies from another angle - pretending to believe.

Later Ba Jin wrote "Caprice Records" and said that he wanted to tell the truth. What do you think of his actions? Ba Jin told a little truth, he said privately—I forgot where I saw it—that I only told a little truth, and didn’t dare to tell the whole truth.According to his own statement, if the scale is wider and the words are harsher, it will not be published.Or, even if they come out, they will be covered up.This truth also has a scale problem, ten percent truth, three-point truth, or one-point truth?If he can tell the truth to five or six points, it is considered very good.Compared to one or two points, it must have improved.Not telling lies is progress.

You said just now that China is a system prone to lies. I was wondering why the system of lies has been maintained in China for so long? It costs very little, and the benefits are high.The core of this system is the group of people who conquer the world and rule the country. If they want to exercise rule effectively at low cost, then it is very natural for him to adopt this strategy.In addition, the so-called lies are nothing more than saying how this rule or system is in line with the people's will.If this system is changed to a system of democratically elected government, and becomes a transaction between the common people and the providers of public services, then it will be a system of transactions, and the elected person will naturally conform to the will of the people, so there is no need to fabricate lies.And in this trading system, all parties must be watching whether you have fulfilled the contract honestly.So this system happens to be a system to eliminate lies. If you break the contract and lie, it is generally not worth the loss.

Living in such a system of lies, I myself feel that your personality is split. The possibility of division is like this: you have to say something that you don't agree with, and you know it is a lie, but you still say it, which forms a division.In doing so, you have to deal with lying, to rationalize it, to find that inner, spiritual strategy.It is easy to split if not handled well.There is another state: although you are required to lie, but I don't lie, I will tell the truth.When I got to the field where I had to lie, I couldn't tell the truth anymore, so I stopped talking.This can also be done without splitting.I go as far as I can, and then I stand still. I was wondering what is Teacher Wu Si's attitude towards telling the truth?Like never lie, try not to lie, lie occasionally, or what? Let's limit this to political issues, which is domestic political views, and I'm just telling the truth.If you can't tell the truth, don't tell lies, that's it.If you want to say normal things, such as asking if you are well, you are obviously sick, so don't worry your parents, just say yes.Such so-called white lies are inevitable.